When was the last time any of the feedback was actioned on?

It feels important for me to say, as someone who has been a creator and patron on Patreon since they had about 15 staff (way back in Mar 2014), has met Jack several times and attended the first two Patrecon’s in person, that my experience of Jack and the staff is that they are all absolutely authentic in their mission of enabling creators to get paid for their creations.

I’m not in denying the concerns voiced here by so many, I just feel it’s imperative that I express that the actual humans behind Patreon are some of the most real people I’ve ever met. I felt held, inspired, seen and valued every time I visited HQ or attended one of their events.

My wish now is that that same energy and authenticity gets communicated via critical results on the platform itself.

The mobile experience, the API (I mean, how could they drop that!?), the overall patron experience and so many other little and not-so-little issues need to be resolved ASAP!

Wishing you all a blessed year ahead, may Patreon be like the phoenix, rising from the ashes of what it was, and into the light of what it deserves to be, for every single person who works at, creates on or supports creators there!

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i’m sorry reyna, we’re not frustrated at YOU.

but there’s only so many times we can be told “we’re working on it, we promise” and “there’s so much to do” before our trust in patreon is completely eroded. you’ve been working on it for THREE YEARS. we are your customers. if patreon doesn’t pick up the ball and get it rolling, we’ll find better alternatives and you’ll lose us as customers. we WANT to use this site! we like getting paid for our work and building a community and meeting other creators but at this point it’s more frustrating than helpful.

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I actually came here to add that. I’ve been in @reyna’s position before, and none of this is directed toward you. There’s just a lot of frustration building up because Patreon could be even more AMAZING for creators, with just a little bit of work/tweaking/improving…

Brian

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Jack and the staff took feedback in the discord server- he posted up a full pdf of officially considered suggetions/recommendations along w/ complaints. The forum doesn’t support pdf so I screenshotted each page. ^w^

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‘Sharing with our team’ is exactly what we’ve been told for three years, and nothing has happened. Nothing.

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What this thread accomplished is more action and more attention to all above issues mentioned.
I do not disregard your concern, but I do feel as if that alone should show that this isn’t simple anymore. A lot of staff has come out for this. I have faith that they are enacting on it- not just sharing. Because sharing would imply one message in one ear and out the other. When it’s all written out and taken into consideration- that in of itself proves that the message is heard. Not just shared.

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Funny thing, though. The people here, @Mindy and @reyna wrote it down and shared it with the team. So I’m simply looking at past behavior and words. This rings the same way.

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I appreciate you sharing that, but they’ve known a lot of this feedback for years now. It’s been “coming soon” for years now.

Again, nothing against the staff as people, I’m sure they’re great. And again, it’s not /just/ the delay on these features/bugs. We just really want more communication. Some time tables. (I know estimates can be shots in the dark, so give us some idea of what’s being worked on now.) Like I mentioned, quarterly threads would be my top pick suggestion wise. Give us more of an idea of what’s going on, what to expect, etc.

We want proof of actions, not just words.

I really want to hold y’all to that. I hope to see improvements.

I say this genuinely, again, wanting to see this site succeed. I want to trust the company again. I want to feel excited and proud to share and promote my Patreon page. Right now, I just don’t feel that.

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i don’t disbelieve that the team at patreon * knows* about our complaints and suggestions.

but the point of this thread is that we’ve been hearing that same thing for years. we don’t need to hear “thanks for your input, we’ll work on it”. we need to SEE the work being put in.

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What are the competitors people have been moving to? I’ve been on Patreon for 6 years and my, and my 2.8k patrons’ patience has worn wafer thin.

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i follow a lot of models/cosplayers/SWers, so i see them going to onlyfans. still has it’s problems of course, but a lot of creators feel like it gives us more control. and truth be told, it’s a decent platform for a wide range of creation types, it just has a reputation for SW only.

other artists have just been making their own websites and storefronts as well.

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I’ve honestly been considering just blowing off the dust of my old computer science degree and build my own site. I had done so via Wordpress one weekend and use the Patreon API because I was so tired of their layout and wanted a gallery and other things. Patrons loved it. But then the API broke (never really worked right), and I had to ditch it.

I may just create a new site from scratch for myself, import Patron user data from Patreon, and go from there.

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There is a 1st of month issue which affects api connected sites/applications on 1st of month, which is soon going to be looked at. Other than that, ~4000+ WP websites that use the WP plugin are functioning pretty comfortably with the api.

One thing is that hosting greatly affects how a WP site behaves. If there are any security measures (mod_security, cloudflare or other proxies/filters, any custom ip filtering or security measure that is server side or in WP plugins) then this can greatly impact how your site interacts with Patreon api. If configured overzealously, plugins like Wordfence can also make great and unpredictable impact.

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After working with you and the API software for hours trying to figure out how to fix an API authentication loop, I gave up trying to make things work. My site needed to have WooCommerce. And it doesn’t change the fact that I shouldn’t have to send my patrons away from Patreon in order to give them a decent user experience.

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Ah i remember, many of the issues which you experienced 2.5 years ago in that ticket have been fixed.

Majority of issues people experience today come from either web host issues or caching plugins/systems. Even in the case of caching plugins, the plugin gives instructions to caching plugins to not cache gated pages to reduce such cases. Also there are flags set to tell proxies like cloudflare and ISPs to not cache pages, but its up to those services to respect those flags.

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As many others have said already, this has nothing to do with the the integrity or good will of the staff at Patreon. It has everything to do with those good intentions not connecting with their ability to enact any kind of significant change OR for that change to be relevant to the end user.

We have indeed gone through changes, but very few of them have had a positive impact on our workload. The front page changed, and it forced many of us to redo all the work we’d put into our tier banners. It also made it so that we had to lead people to other sites to find out what we were about, because Patreon now hides that information under three scrolls and a “read more” button.

Then the relationship manager changed, and all it did was remove or hide features that we’d been relying on, while introducing other features that were obsolete by the sheer nature of the platform (i.e, marking patrons as “complete” for rewards, while not having a reliable system to deliver these rewards and depending on third party pages to deliver).

Recently there was this topic talking about all these great tools for content delivery - except they’re not just offsite, but you actually have to pay for those services separately. Crowdcast in particular is an especially obtuse choice, given that if you have more than 100 patrons, you’ll be shelling out 90 to 160$ a month to invite them all to your streams. If that doesn’t scream “we don’t know our audience” I don’t know what does.

Meanwhile, we have this thread from Sept 2018 that has so far accumulated over 200 responses - many of them requesting the same core fixes or features: galleries, a functional API, a better notification system, public pinned posts - things that would be expected of a minimal viable product pre-launch, let alone a platform that has been around for 8 years. In this thread, we have 3 posts by Mindy acknowledging “what great feedback this is” and how it’s been passed onto the team, and one by Reyna solving a single particular enquiry without further ado.

As for Jack coming onto Discord, that’s great. But seeing a picture of Jack eating a salad, having him tell me I’m a rockstar and then getting a collage of our comments to pin to the fridge as a trophy does not really ease any of the sentiments I highlighted in my original post. Especially when all of that comes garnished with not one, but TWO disclaimers of “no promises”. If anything, it makes me feel more put off towards the platform and the staff for treating us like children gathering around a campfire to sing kumbaya and pretend we’re all in this together.

Except we’re not. According to this site, “the average Patreon executive compensation is $245,889 a year. The median estimated compensation for executives at Patreon including base salary and bonus is $243,145, or $116 per hour. At Patreon, the most compensated executive makes $790,000, annually, and the lowest compensated makes $34,000.”

If you need a comparative of why we’re not the same and why these “we see you” responses don’t cut it, let it be this: That’s regular income that the staff make because many of us dedicate our entire time to make the platform work. How many of us make that kind of paycheck every year off a platform that hardly does any of the work for us?

Our demands are not irrational. We’re the builders who are more than happy and grateful to work onsite, but need tools that aren’t rusty and a harness in case we slip off the wall. What is irrational, is Patreon responding to that with a thumbs up while they sit inside the building, watching us dangle off the scaffolding.

I will always hope for improvement and I’ll hold onto a healthy amount of optimism for Reyna and Jack’s comments about a better roadmap and communication to be true. I’d love to sit here next year, writing another post to say “Damn, you guys really pulled through!”. But I will also say that if this was the start of that intent, then I am already disappointed and highly sceptical of what shape this is going to take going forward.

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Wow, this was incredibly well said, I feel you and it’s inviting me to look more deeply at my own unwavering belief in Patreon as a whole (I just might be a fanatic :sweat_smile:)

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Subscribestar is the one I’ve heard a couple people moving to, and I’ve also heard of people using Ko-Fi.

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Subscribestar has many of the same deficiencies, BUT they are very, very responsive. I’ve made two feature requests, both of which were added in a reasonable time. Most of my patrons are on Patreon, but I have a couple ‘beta testing’ Subscribestar.

We’ll see how it goes. And for those who care, they allow partial payouts.

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@ArtwithFlo I’ve been looking into moving my tiny amount of patrons compared to you (!) and most competitors offer to move your patrons over for you, with special codes etc for them too. Depending on what website you have as your main art site, you might already be able to do it pretty easily. Feel free to PM me as I did a LOT Of research of where to go last year. Hoping to move this year.

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